Had an Interesting Night

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I have lived in a rural area like yours, similarly without any expectation of LE arriving in less than 40 minutes,...and while I'm all for being your own police,...I have to join the others who have properly identified that you acted outside the law.

I'm not gonna condemn you for it. I understand your motivation and determination to (perceivedly) defend your castle. While I do not say you were morally wrong,...legally speaking, you were.
 
I've lived most of my 71 years in rural areas. You do have to have your guard up especially at night. Seems the deviates like to go out at night. Having had more than one experience with deviates coming around without any chance of law enforcement helping any time soon, I have yet to have the need to fire a weapon in a deadly or threatening manner.

The fact that the guy was leaving the scene put you in the wrong for firing a round even in a safe direction. Self defense is when there is a threat you perceive to be life threatening to you or someone else. You can't, for instance, legally shoot a known thief leaving your house with your belongings. He is leaving and therefore no threat to your life.

Bottom line, you won't likely hear anymore about the subject since cops would likely look the other way since there is no proof or charges being filed. Or?...
 
I wasn't going to participate in the thread because I promised myself I wouldn't get entrenched in "people doing weird irresponsible shit" threads but ... I want to propose another reason this was a bad idea.

Legal ramifications seem covered by several posters above but try this

I know many people on gun boards are ninja, special forces warriors capable of vanquishing 10 men with three carefully placed bullets, in the dark, while doing a forward evasive roll. That clearly can go without saying but .... just in case your not. You potentially opened yourself up to a gun fight and if you didn't win your suspected criminals might have been able to claim self defense.

Lets look at it a bit just based on what I was able to read without shaking my head.

You couldn't see the bad guy/guys. It was dark and you couldn't get past your bushes and they were near your gate but not inside of it. You siced the dogs on them and then fired a shot.

Now .. if I were out hunting, camping, lost in the desert after a hiking trip and my car broke down and its dark I am worried, annoyed and probably a bit frightened. Now here I am fixing my car and some stranger whom I cant see because of the dark and bushes just put dogs on me and has fired a gun.

Did I stumble on a Marijuana farm!? A meth Lab!? who are these bad guys trying to kill me in the desert!!

I have to be honest ... If I cant get my vehicle out and I have someone chasing me with a gun in the dark alone .. I might just return fire. I might be very likely to take cover and send a few 10mm rounds at the person who is ATTACKING ME without provocation and a jury of Californians might even agree that it was self defense since you attacked someone without warning.

Its very attractive to act like ol jeb in some bad hillbilly movie and "I let loose a blast from my ol shotgun nelly to Chasin off them trespassers" but how is this for an idea. Maybe they needed help.

Maybe the God that gets mentioned an awful lot on the gun board would have liked you to go there, armed and with your dogs, to see how you could be of service to a fellow human being. Nah that is stupid .. they didn't teach anything like that when I went to church.

Setting aside just bad taste. It was tactically stupid. You didnt know how many people there were. You couldnt see past your bushes, it was dark. Had someone already flanked you while you were wandering around? Was someone behind that tree or in that gully? Did you fire from cover? You had already given away your exact position when you called out to your dogs. Just so much Wrong
 
Well I got to tell you , you are probably a good candidate for the red flag law. The guy wasn't even on your property. You fired off a round i guess into the dirt, not at any intended target just the dirt. Could have hit a dog. Everyone around you are probably awake now. Lucky someone didnt call the cops. He was probably trying to shoot up or get a blo& job. Who knows. But him getting out of his car down the road looking at his car means he thought you shot his car. Yup Red Flag law all over this conduct. On top of all this you documented it here on this public fourm. WTF.
 
Lets set the scene a little better. On the 10 miles of dirt road to get to my house (it continues on much further) there are exactly 5 houses, to include mine and neighbors, that can be directly accessed from the road. With one more house where the rancher lives a bit over a mile further out, after which the road continues even further into the boonies. I am on a hill top and can see for miles and for 360 degrees from horizon to horizon there are 10 houses, not all of which are occupied.

Where the vehicle parked was the only spot where they can observe both our houses, though they would have had a clearer view of his. Where his wife, young daughter and mother-in-law are often home alone at night. There isn't much in the way of people just passing through as the road doesn't really go any place. It splits past the ranch house with one branch petering out to the south and the other branch leading to an even more middle of nowhere spot in NM. You either belong there or you don't and people who do, know that. Hence why the lady with flat tire (who lived further past us) put on her flashers to make it obvious she wasn't trying to hide as it sure wasn't concern for nonexistent traffic. The only odd thing that attracted attention in her case was the indistinct yelling of her kid.

There are meth heads and other assorted bad guys out here because they like the fact the cops NEVER patrol the area. The general area has long been used by smugglers (even before the US Highway was put in) as it was (and still is) the only route that goes from the Mex border up to Canada without passing through a city of any size. It is still used for smuggling to this day and also as a place to conduct business or dump a body off down a side road such as mine.

So more often then not a vehicle just hanging around after dark is a warning sign. As unlike city dwellers we don't have the umbrella of protection given by police patrols. No cop is going to pull up and politely ask them what they are doing parked out here.

The idea was prevention. I would much rather waste a bullet into the dirt then have to later shoot it into a person (even a bad guy) or come home to a ransacked house. There was zero chance of hitting my dogs, the car, my neighbor coming up the other side of the road along his fence line or a neighbor's house. As I posted already, If they had bad intentions they are reconsidering them now. If they didn't then other then a bit of a scare no harm came to them.

As for neighbors calling the cops for hearing a shot, there are four of us within a square mile. The closest was right there with the same idea, and the only two others in the area (but can't be reached directly from the road) are both older couples with disabilities who greatly appreciate us keeping an eye out. No one calls the cops over a shot out here (nor would the sheriff even respond), we simply check with each other to make sure everyone is safe.



Which of these two situations are preferable...

1: Guy gets backed into a corner by 3 guys he has never seen before in a parking lot. Happening in mere seconds they tell him what they are going to do and he knows what's coming but can't get away. He tells them he has a gun but they just laugh as it's CA after all. They jump him and he pulls out his carry pistol and shoots one dead and the rest scatter. High 5's all around for following the laws as he didn't pull pistol until they actually attacked him and a legal shoot right?

2: Guy minding his own business gets backed into a corner by 3 guys he has never seen before in a parking lot. Happening in mere seconds they tell him what they are going to do and he knows what's coming but can't get away. He tells them he has a gun but they just laugh as it's CA after all. However before they jump him he moves his jacket to let then see his pistol. Three guys suddenly decide they have prior business elsewhere so he doesn't have to shoot anyone and they all go home that night. But oh no you say, that's illegal brandishing, he wasn't a responsible gun owner, etc, etc, etc.

The second version is what happened to a guy I know and in my opinion was by far the more desired outcome of the two. Despite the fact that modern gun owners have been conditioned to see it as illegal.
 
lol, why worry about justifying what you did, if they don't like it fudg'em most wouldn'dt do shiat due to the panty wrinkling they would have if they had the situation, just saying, lol
Rj
 
Here's one for u steve. Let me set the scene up for you. It's raining hard cant see sh!t. I'm late to pick up my girl friend at here friends house I have no idea where or what house she is in. She tells me to travel down this road but doesn't go into details about where she is. I'm 16 and not really good at driving in the day light let alone at night in the dark. I stop near a gate thinking this is the right place. I try to call her but she is not answering. My phone is starting to die and I'm no closer to her at all. What do I do? I'm scared. I get out and try to get to the nearest house to ask for directions. Or I stay in my car.
Now this can go 2 ways
I get out of my car you shoot me or your dogs maul me and I die or sue you. Because you cant identify who you are looking at or where your dogs are going.
Or I stay in the car where I think I'm safe and you squeeze off a round and somehow it hits the car.
What if. For a Marine, if I were you I would identify your threat. Make sure he or she is a threat and not someone that needs assistance, and then go forward with the needed actions for the proper problem. :clap: :clap: :clap:
 
knockonit said:
lol, why worry about justifying what you did, if they don't like it fudg'em most wouldn'dt do shiat due to the panty wrinkling they would have if they had the situation, just saying, lol
Rj

No panty wrinkling here! I can and will defend myself quite vigorously if called upon. I have the advantage of still being somewhat healthy and strong but old enough to have done all the really cool shit I need to do so death worries me not in the least.

However .. Nothing in the OP's story indicated ANYTHING I need to defend myself against since I think hanging out near your car on the other side of a gate is still legal. While I dont care if I hit the dirt box tomorrow I would rather not spend my remaining time in a jail cell. Anyone that has ever had the misfortune of visiting the inside of a jail should know its no place you want to be.

Add to that .. I have no desire to kill or maim anyone and am just fine going out without having done it. To many guys seem to be looking for the opportunity to whip out their dik and show how tough they are. I'm cool. I know what I have and when to use it and I have a proven track record of having defended myself in circumstances many will never find themselves. If pressed, I will fight like I care about living. Parking near my home doesn't warrant that reaction.

IMHO .. popping off your gun to show you mean business is everything the wrong stereotype is about gun owners and supporters of the 2nd.

To me the panty wrinkling is the guy who has to run out and pop of his cap gun because he is scared of the wind, and people and cars or some such shit. Im just not that much of a pussy that I am afraid of everything.
 
I once lived on a road much like Steve described. People did go down that road with jeeps and motor cycles and often were doing drugs and getting themselves in wrecks and stuck in creek crossings. It was in the mountains. We always had a big dog and I think that was enough to keep most of the goof balls away from our house. But there were times things got interesting but I never shot a gun to warn anyone. Had we needed to defend ourselves, that would have been different. But not to scare someone off.

Some people might also take offense to being warned with a shot and come back some time to get even when you least expect them. No. That wasn't a good idea to do a warning shot in the dark.
 
Let's look at it from another direction...If the homeowner (steve in 29) has enough acreage and is allowed to target shoot on his own land, he can do that day or night, and whether or not anyone is on the road out front or not, right? He popped a shot off, in a safe direction (same as target shooting) and someone just happened to be out front. Exactly the same thing as target shooting on ones own land, IMO. It's not like he screamed 'YOU'RE A DEAD MFer, PUNK!!' and then took the shot. He doesn't need to go check and see if the road is clear for miles around before target shooting on his land. In fact, just to appease everyone, 'steve in 29' should set up a target around back of the house and if something like this happens again, he can just step out onto the back porch and dump a whole mag at the target so no one gets upset about putting one in the dirt instead. That way, everyone can officially call it 'target practice', and I'll bet the car will still drive away quickly. No harm, no foul.

10 miles down a dirt road...we don't even know if he's 'within city limits' where discharging a firearm would be illegal...sounds like he's outside the city there...
 
Spin it any way you want. That is not the reason he fired the gun. In his words, He fired the gun AND sent his dogs after the person because they were on a roadway NEAR his property. No matter how you spin it in or out of city limits that is flagrant disorderly conduct, threatening and intimidating and approaching aggravated assault. All in his words no one else's.

In no way were the actions he described justifiable nor reasonable.
 
Any way I got a good laugh out of this. I believe steve got the hint. Even though steve and I don't get along and that's fine I believe he has learned from this and I'm willing to let him get up and dust himself off and we can get back to hating each other again.
 
Got the hint...city people are pussies and rely on the cops as their safety net instead of providing their own.

You all would rather high 5 killing someone in a good shoot then try to prevent the need to shoot someone in the first place. Because...where's the fun in that.

Yep no city limits, no worried neighbors, zero chance of hitting anyone/thing, no frightened 16yo boys trying to find their girlfriend in the rain

I asked admin to delete the thread so everyone's panties can get unbunched.

I won't make the mistake of upsetting the Nervous Nellie's again
 
Not to many folks know what's like living out in rural area.
 
this sh!t was funny and entertaining, thank you all for playing...now back to our regularly scheduled program...
 
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