AR versus AK - which is better? Why?

[17-21-23]

Ok. I have read all of this. It's a loaded question. Here are the facts
1. Ar platforms are yes easier to work on and change into any configuration you want.
2. Ar platforms are more finicky with ammo. Brass only no steel.
3. We all know, well at least us veterans. Ar15's run wet. That means you use oil a lot.
4. Parts are everywhere. I mean all over the place. Every Tom, d*** and Harry have parts.
5. They are weather and terrain finicky as well.
Now the AK
1. Hard to work on.
2. Special tools more so than the AR15
3. You will need a 2 to 8 ton press
4. Parts are harder to come by.
5.AK rifles eat any ammo you put in them they don't care.
6.Jungle, Desart, swamp and mud it just keeps on going. You can run it dry or pee on it for lubrication.

Usually the understanding is when you get into country ,you pick up whatever they are using. That way when they hear it going off they think it's one of their own.
In the end if you are in a dry, clean place and have oil use a AR15. If you are outside in the mud or sand and it's raining pick up the AK

I agree with Ranger1 For the most part. However, You can run steel cases all day long in an AR. That is not necessarily true with an M16 tho. That is where he has some confusion. My first 2 AR15s, Before I started reloading, I ran Tulammo 223 exclusively and probably went thru 20-30K rounds of it.

 

[Ranger1]

Well here is the deal. Stoner never made the AR to take steel cases. Chamber tolerances, the way the locking lugs work and the extractor design never had steel cases in mind.

Here are the differences in the chambers you can get in the AR15

•The first is the Mil-Spec 5.56mm chamber, which is used in the M16 and M4.
•The second is the .223 chamber, the most common chamber in AR-15 rifles, although you can
get AR-15s with a 5.56mm chamber
•The third is a .223 Match chamber, which is used in AR-15s by serious competitive AR-15 shooters.
Even with all these options they still don't like the steel cases.

M16 and AR15 (Armalite Rifle 15) chambers are basically the same other than the three from above.

The problems you are going to face with steel cased ammo.
1. Stuck cases
2. Double feeds
3. Broken extractors
Our army and country run brass cased ammo not steel. Everyone I have ever encountered that tried to run steel cases dry stuck cases starting around the first 35 to 40 rounds. When the AR heats up and you have steel on steel going on and that's when you have malfunctions. I'm not saying you can't run steel in your AR, I have. I get 40 rounds through it before I have issues. Using a lot of oil I get 80 before experiencing problems. I fixed all me issues when I had my chamber fluted like the HK91. After that I never had a problem. But we are not talking about modified AR's, we are talking about AR's off the shelf from the factory.
Here are some pictures of fluted chambers and a case once fired from a fluted chamber.

 

[17-21-23]

I was referring to my DPMS Oracle and and my Del-Ton Echo 3:16. Never had an issue. I would run 3-500 rounds with my wife thru each gun, one mag after the other. Pew pew pew pew

 

[Ranger1]

Your are very lucky to have a wife that wants to shoot with you. Mine hates shooting.

 

[17-21-23]

Your are very lucky to have a wife that wants to shoot with you. Mine hates shooting.

Well, she will be in a bad place if she ever encounters the bad guy. My wife carries a .380ACP and packs a GP100 357 4" in the glove. She also goes shooting with me anytime I ask if she wants to go.

 

[17-21-23]

If she did not like to go shooting, she would still be my girlfriend, Maybe.

 

[Steve_In_29]

flutes3.jpgflutes2.jpgflutes1.jpgWell here is the deal. Stoner never made the AR to take steel cases. Chamber tolerances, the way the locking lugs work and the extractor design never had steel cases in mind.

Here are the differences in the chambers you can get in the AR15

•The first is the Mil-Spec 5.56mm chamber, which is used in the M16 and M4.
•The second is the .223 chamber, the most common chamber in AR-15 rifles, although you can
get AR-15s with a 5.56mm chamber
•The third is a .223 Match chamber, which is used in AR-15s by serious competitive AR-15 shooters.
Even with all these options they still don't like the steel cases.

M16 and AR15 (Armalite Rifle 15) chambers are basically the same other than the three from above.

The problems you are going to face with steel cased ammo.
1. Stuck cases
2. Double feeds
3. Broken extractors
Our army and country run brass cased ammo not steel. Everyone I have ever encountered that tried to run steel cases dry stuck cases starting around the first 35 to 40 rounds. When the AR heats up and you have steel on steel going on and that's when you have malfunctions. I'm not saying you can't run steel in your AR, I have. I get 40 rounds through it before I have issues. Using a lot of oil I get 80 before experiencing problems. I fixed all me issues when I had my chamber fluted like the HK91. After that I never had a problem. But we are not talking about modified AR's, we are talking about AR's off the shelf from the factory.
Here are some pictures of fluted chambers and a case once fired from a fluted chamber.

There is at least one AR manufacturer that is doing fluted chambers right from the factory.

It seems the AR wasn't a perfect design, no matter what the fanbois might claim.

 

[Tim McBride]

LOL, plenty of ARs can shoot steel cased ammo all day long.
And you don't need a spray bottle of CLP to keep one functioning.

 

[Ranger1]

Who is making the fluted chamber?

 

[Ranger1]

LOL, plenty of ARs can shoot steel cased ammo all day long.
And you don't need a spray bottle of CLP to keep one functioning.

I'm interested in knowing which ones can shoot steal cased ammo all day long without problems. Do you have a list. I do distruction testing for Elftmann Tactical Trigger and brass cases ammo is expensive. Now that I know I won't have a problem with steel I will start buying it, just need to know those barrel manufacturers you are talking about.

 

[Steve_In_29]

Who is making the fluted chamber?

POF is from what I recall.

 

[Tim McBride]

LOL, plenty of ARs can shoot steel cased ammo all day long.
And you don't need a spray bottle of CLP to keep one functioning.

I'm interested in knowing which ones can shoot steal cased ammo all day long without problems. Do you have a list. I do distruction testing for Elftmann Tactical Trigger and brass cases ammo is expensive. Now that I know I won't have a problem with steel I will start buying it, just need to know those barrel manufacturers you are talking about.

How many rounds in one shooting session would make you believe that an AR can fire steel cased ammo as well as brass cased ammo?

 

[17-21-23]

How many rounds in one shooting session would make you believe that an AR can fire steel cased ammo as well as brass cased ammo?
[/quote]
I can shoot 20, 30 round mags out of my Del-ton or the DPMS. These are factory guns. I only say 20 mags because I do not reload at the range and I only have 20 mags.

 

[harleypower69]

AK is generally a better battle rifle at closer ranges. I find the AK to be more forgiving in harsh environments such as mud or sand. Easier to train an operator on usage and cleaning procedures.
The AR, in my experience, is a better battle rifle for longer range engagements where accuracy is crucial. I have owned some AR's that ate any and all ammo and then some that are so tight they are picky (my LMT mod is picky due to tight tolerances as an example).

 

[Ranger1]

The whole lineup of the AK is better than the AR line up on the battle field. You want long distance go for a Dragunov sniper rifle. Cheep and very accurate.

 

[Shoot th3 moon]

I like my AR but.... the AK has a nice bark

 

[lew]

The whole lineup of the AK is better than the AR line up on the battle field. You want long distance go for a Dragunov sniper rifle. Cheep and very accurate.

:lol:

An SVD will hit a man-sized target out to about 800m, but it's no sniper rifle, nor was it intended as such. Also, at least in this country, "SVD" and "cheap" don't belong in the same sentence. The AR series has the AK whipped for versatility- CQB-oriented models, to DMR's, and all the way to genuine sniper rifles.

 

[Ranger1]

The whole lineup of the AK is better than the AR line up on the battle field. You want long distance go for a Dragunov sniper rifle. Cheep and very accurate.

:lol:

An SVD will hit a man-sized target out to about 800m, but it's no sniper rifle, nor was it intended as such. Also, at least in this country, "SVD" and "cheap" don't belong in the same sentence. The AR series has the AK whipped for versatility- CQB-oriented models, to DMR's, and all the way to genuine sniper rifles.

That's just your opinion against my opinion. Nothing special. Just another day

 

[Ranger1]

O by the way, the accuracy of the SVD is farther than 800. Some say 1000 meters. I guess its , again , who is behind the weapon and what ammo you use. Cheap? I call $1500 cheap

 

[lew]

The whole lineup of the AK is better than the AR line up on the battle field. You want long distance go for a Dragunov sniper rifle. Cheep and very accurate.

:lol:

An SVD will hit a man-sized target out to about 800m, but it's no sniper rifle, nor was it intended as such. Also, at least in this country, "SVD" and "cheap" don't belong in the same sentence. The AR series has the AK whipped for versatility- CQB-oriented models, to DMR's, and all the way to genuine sniper rifles.

That's just your opinion against my opinion. Nothing special. Just another day

Aside from the first sentence, you would be correct, but the SVD was developed as what we know as a designated marksman rifle, and the AK lineup is not terribly accurate compared to an AR chambered in a comparable cartridge. No opinions involved there. Choose the rifle that works best for you.