Bill of Sale

[Ballistic Therapy]

I always get a bill of sale and it must contain

Copy of drivers license
Copy of birth certificate
Social security number
Bank account , routing number , pin number
Valid credit card and CVV number , preferably Visa
Paypal address and password
Social media passwords
Mothers maiden name
Fathers middle name
City you where born in
Home address
Phone number
Picture of buyer or seller
Picture of license plate
Credit check

This is for my protection only.

[Flash]

I always get a bill of sale and it must contain

Copy of drivers license
Copy of birth certificate
Social security number
Bank account , routing number , pin number
Valid credit card and CVV number , preferably Visa
Paypal address and password
Social media passwords
Mothers maiden name
Fathers middle name
City you where born in
Home address
Phone number
Picture of buyer or seller
Picture of license plate
Credit check

This is for my protection only.

I want all of that, plus I want 6 people who will sign an affidavit that you are of sound mind.

[Harrier]

I guess I'm the only one that didn't go along with the herd...

I said that if I was on the 4473 as the original buyer, I wanted to copy an ID #... that may have been a poor choice of words, as I didn't mean I wanted to photo their ID, I just want to copy down their name and DL#, which I might keep in an encrypted file anonymously tucked away on the computer... or I might toss in the trash as they know I have a trace-back. I don't care where they live, as long as the ID is of the same state I live in, (for handguns... long guns technically can be sold to residents of neighboring states but I wouldn't want to pay to be the test case).

I want some assurance if in the future, I get a knock on the door because my name came up in a crime trace, then I can point them down the road... I ain't gonna cover your a** and pay to clear myself if you or someone you flipped the piece to screws up. I don't know you, I don't wanna know you and I sure as he** don't want to take a fall for you.

I don't often sell any of my papered guns so this is not something I commonly do, but if I do sell a registered gun then I will want to cover my butt and that is the primary reason.

There may not be any AZ documentation requirement but there are Federal requirements about sales to non-residents, age restrictions and felony/DV status. No written answers are required but reasonable doubt on the sellers part is. Now if you want to ignore asking and sell to just anyone, you are risking getting caught in an ATF sting. If that is something you want to avoid, then asking the question gives you some plausible deniability even if they lie...at least you asked, so who cares.

Most of the time a FTF sale is done at a gun-show by chance meeting anyway, so only a DL flash is required to help mitigate the possible gun-show sting..
If a sale is done through a forum, such as this one, there is probably enough electronic data saved to show dates trace IP's, but it doesn't hurt to ask for a flash.

I understand the buyers concerns too, as I have bought many private party guns over the years... the main concern is 'what if it is stolen or used in a crime' and 'what if some cop runs the # and it comes back on me?' It may not have been the guy you bought it from, but maybe 2 guys removed that tainted the merch... how you gonna talk you way outta that one?

I agree with what all of you have said - a gun is just like a TV and should be considered as private property in the same vein, but the reality is they are not. No matter what you feel, if you get caught up in legal red tape, your gonna get ink on ya. These days both buyer and seller have to be careful. Some deals are best to walk away from and sometimes you just need that extra assurance you can slip out of the knot. It ain't about the money...

Remember the guy who just sold some ammo to the LV shooter?
He got screwed anyway.

[knockonit]

talk about a subject thats been beat to death, argh

[samnev]

In all my dealings with buying and selling I've only had 1person ask fo a BOS. I didn't do business with him.

[Ballistic Therapy]

I want all of that, plus I want 6 people who will sign an affidavit that you are of sound mind.

I used to do that but I kept running into people that couldn't come up with enough people to vouch for them.

[shooter444]

talk about a subject thats been beat to death, argh

Yup!,... but, I am still amazed at how many sellers are still doing it,... take a look in the classifieds, plenty of Cali mentality still around.

[knockonit]

yip, can't fix paranoid and silly, they gotta do what they gotta do, as do buyers,
happy monday, just glad to be here
Rj

[Boriqua]

talk about a subject thats been beat to death, argh

I was thinking the same thing RJ... jeez .. Are their no cool new guns to talk about that every 4 months like clock work we have to have this thread.

I always find it amusing that the people who scream the loudest about my freedom this and my freedom that ... vilify someone for using his or her freedom to sell THEIR s*** however the fuk they want.

For a group of live in a bunker, have my bug out bag ready, survival individualist .. sure is a lot of herd braying going on.

I will say the same thing I have on 4 other threads .. see an ad that has criteria you dont abide by .. Pass!

[pvreb]

I agree with the majority here. Any ID requirements, BOS, etc. and I pass.

[ale4me]

Folks are right here. There is no legal requirement. However, some feel that it will absolve them of civil liability if used in a commission of a crime. Doubtful at best. If your that concerned, do the transfer at an FFL. I personally want see an ID (not record the information), to make sure the person isn’t from a prohibited state. It’s happened.

[TacMedic]

talk about a subject thats been beat to death, argh

Yup!,... but, I am still amazed at how many sellers are still doing it,... take a look in the classifieds, plenty of Cali mentality still around.

Only reason I brought it up, I noticed this on many of the classifieds.....

[Seif]

Hard pass on the BOS. I'll flash my DL and CCW if requested but that's it.

[xerts1191]

Is a bill of sale really any good without a third party witness and a notarization

[shooter444]

Is a bill of sale really any good with a fake signature by a criminal, and witnessed by his/her partner in crime!