WHY

[QuietM4]

QM4, I'm not sure there is any way to verify how accurate the 16% voting rate is for gun owners, but anecdotally, looking at the anemic membership in AZCDL I’m very inclined to feel it's accurate.

Me and several others have pushed membership in AZCDL here and 2 other local gun forums. The response has gone from underwhelming to flat out complaints about embarrassing people.

Keep in mind, many in these groups shout in all CAPS “from my cold dead hands” or some variant. I find it extremely hard to believe they can be relied upon to pick up arms if they won’t pick up a ballot, a pen, a phone or join an organization where they do nothing but join.

Maybe it’s pure lazy, or the stupid assumption that it won’t happen here but resisting when there is no bloodshed required does not inspire my confidence in the majority on these forums who scream "let them try".

Anemic numbers for AZCDL in no way surprises me.

There are 3,544 members of this board. I see the same 15 members regularly posting. I’ll be gracious and say it’s 50 regular posting members; that is 1.4% of all members that are regularly active (participating) on this board. If we’re to guess, I’d bet the top 15 active members are responsible for +60% of posts here. So at best, maybe 200 people will see your AZCDL posts.

What does one get with his/her AZCDL membership? The org is going to present and help write state laws regardless of members or not, so that’s a wash. There are 8 sponsors listed in the AZCDL site that offer discounts to members; I’ve heard of 3 of the 8, and shop at 1/8…and I didn’t even know they offered a discount to AZCDL members…and I doubt the people working there know it, either.

[YNOTAZ]

I hate to say it but you have to be dumber than a rock. An organization with no member has no money, no mass, no capability to help write state laws, no influence, and would not even exist.

You want to make excuses for letting everyone else carry your water go right ahead, but your excuse, you don't get a discount is just plain dumb.

I had much more respect for you until you wrote that....

[kenpoprofessor]

I hate to say it but you have to be dumber than a rock. An organization with no member has no money, no mass, no capability to help write state laws, no influence, and would not even exist.

You want to make excuses for letting everyone else carry your water go right ahead, but your excuse, you don't get a discount is just plain dumb.

I had much more respect for you until you wrote that....

Face it dude, we need people for the AZCDL, but honestly, do we need folks like that? It seems like no one wants to do the light lift to get to the heavy lift of being part of something bigger, well, unless they get a discount. They are beyond shame at this point, they'd rather lose their rights than actively work to prevent it.

Have a great, gun carryin', Kenpo day

Clyde

[QuietM4]

My point was that people just don’t pay to join groups unless they see a real tangible benefit. Either there is no tangible benefits of AZCDL, or the group doesn’t do a great job of explaining the benefits and/or accomplishments.

Someone has to create AZCDL, and I would bet that person or persons were already involved, in some way, in the state gun laws. No one says “I’d like to help create and mold state gun laws, but only if people will pay me first”.

[knockonit]

its amazing how a few lines can remove any doubt of ones ignorance, boy howdy, a liberal has shown their true face

[thom]

My point was that people just don’t pay to join groups unless they see a real tangible benefit. Either there is no tangible benefits of AZCDL, or the group doesn’t do a great job of explaining the benefits and/or accomplishments.

Someone has to create AZCDL, and I would bet that person or persons were already involved, in some way, in the state gun laws. No one says “I’d like to help create and mold state gun laws, but only if people will pay me first”.

From what I understand that is exactly what happened, except for the " pay me first" statement. 5 guys in Tucson decided that enough was enough. One of the founding members, still in the state is Charles Heller, the media director now. You can contact him on the AZCDL website. I believe part of the membership funds is used to attract new members, pamphlets, papers, stickers ect.

[YNOTAZ]

M but only if people will pay me first”.

There is nobody at AZCDL that is an employee, no "pay me first". They are all volunteers, have other jobs or are retired from other jobs, working to protect our firearms rights in Arizona. Several folks here are AZCDL members and volunteer their time and money to support this effort, not a one getting paid first or last.

The guys running AZCDL have gotten beneficial firearms laws passed and have stood against the 24 anti-gun laws introduced just this session. They are not the NRA, nobody is flying on private jets and all the efforts are local where you can see them, like the lawsuit against Pima county where you can see the efforts.

Your choice but I will be the first to, as impolitely as possible, rub collective noses in it, if the California influence succeeds here.

[QuangTri]

I joined AZCDL on faith, them being the only Arizona organization keeping watch on the state government in a time of liberal subversion.

Do not trust the NRA to do much of anything these days, though I am a life member.

[YNOTAZ]

I joined AZCDL on faith, them being the only Arizona organization keeping watch on the state government in a time of liberal subversion.
Do not trust the NRA to do much of anything these days, though I am a life member.

Welcome to AZCDL and thanks for joining.

[hrob]

A serious question. WTF is wrong with gun owners?

By a large majority, gun owners don’t register to vote and the registered gun owners don’t vote.

I’m not looking for a defensive, “I vote all the time” answer, but do you know another gun owner that gives a reason for not voting.

We all preach to the choir here, how do we reach non-registered, non-voters, FUDDS, and the rest of the gun owners?

Many gun owners are worried about being put on a "list". We already know ATF is keeping an illegal gun registry, so they are on a list.

WHY?

What makes you think there is a "large majority" of gun owners who don't vote? Because this isn't my experience at all. Every gun owner I know is very politically aware and votes. And I know a LOT of gun owners. In fact, some of the gun owners I know became politically aware because they bought a gun. They went from being ignorant of the 2A to supporters of the 2A.
I don't intend to be argumentative but what do you base your premise on? I realize that less than 5% of gun owners are members of pro-gun organizations like the NRA but that doesn't necessarily mean that a majority of the rest don't vote - it simply means they're cheapskates.

[thom]

The last 2nd Amendment Foundation letter that I received said over 159.8 million Americans voted in 2020. And over 106 million Americans own guns. So why can't we get them to vote more often to protect our rights?

[knockonit]

A serious question. WTF is wrong with gun owners?

By a large majority, gun owners don’t register to vote and the registered gun owners don’t vote.

I’m not looking for a defensive, “I vote all the time” answer, but do you know another gun owner that gives a reason for not voting.

We all preach to the choir here, how do we reach non-registered, non-voters, FUDDS, and the rest of the gun owners?

Many gun owners are worried about being put on a "list". We already know ATF is keeping an illegal gun registry, so they are on a list.

WHY?

What makes you think there is a "large majority" of gun owners who don't vote? Because this isn't my experience at all. Every gun owner I know is very politically aware and votes. And I know a LOT of gun owners. In fact, some of the gun owners I know became politically aware because they bought a gun. They went from being ignorant of the 2A to supporters of the 2A.
I don't intend to be argumentative but what do you base your premise on? I realize that less than 5% of gun owners are members of pro-gun organizations like the NRA but that doesn't necessarily mean that a majority of the rest don't vote - it simply means they're cheapskates.

Out of curiosity Hrob are you a member of any gun rights organization. And might i ask if you are a neophyte recently, say in last decade, curiosity only, no intent, knowledge is power they say.

[hrob]

Out of curiosity Hrob are you a member of any gun rights organization. And might i ask if you are a neophyte recently, say in last decade, curiosity only, no intent, knowledge is power they say.

I am a member of three gun rights organizations. I've been a regular, uninterrupted annual NRA member for close to forty eight years and, more recently, I joined Gun Owners of America and AZCDL.

To answer your second question, I've been a shooter and reloader for the same forty eight years and for the past 25 years or so I've been casting my own bullets - depending on the application of course.

No ill intent taken.

[knockonit]

thanks Hrob appreciate the memberships and standing the post, curiosity allows me to determine if folks are sincere in their comments or just attempting to create havoc or mayhem, lol. well it is the interwebs, thanks again,
Rj

[YNOTAZ]

What makes you think there is a "large majority" of gun owners who don't vote?

Simple, because of Kamel's recent flip flops on guns, two studies were done on that specific topic. While nobody can give an exact number one study said over 70% of gun owners do not vote, and the other said only 16% of gun owners do vote.

So say both of them are full of crap, but kind of close. Double their percentages, and gun owners still suck at protecting our rights, does the word FUDD come to mind?

Take your own statement:

Every gun owner I know is very politically aware and votes. And I know a LOT of gun owners. In fact, some of the gun owners I know became politically aware because they bought a gun. They went from being ignorant of the 2A to supporters of the 2A.
I don't intend to be argumentative but what do you base your premise on? I realize that less than 5% of gun owners are members of pro-gun organizations like the NRA but that doesn't necessarily mean that a majority of

Out of all the gun owners you know what percentage is that of 120 million gun owners. Why does NRA only have 5% support by gun owners, and if you or they don't like NRA how about GOA, SAF, JPFO, or locally AZCDL.

You see I will be argumentative on this, gun owners are slugs. They won't write they won't call, they won't speak, they won't even join an organization to hire someone else to speak for them.

Why didn't you and all your gun totting buddies step up to help us fight the BLM closing thousands of acres to shooting and planning for thousands more. Several thousand members amongst three local shooting forums, 17 people stepped up to help.

So yeah I believe most gun owners are lazy, and frankly I laugh my arsse off when they cry "from my cold dead hands" and "let them try to take it". A real joke.