Israel reverses stance on gun control

[Half Cocked]

It's a little bit late ... but better late than never.

Colion Noir on Israel's decision to allow its citizens to arm themselves.



Israel Festival-Goers 'Defenseless' After Gun Ban

Some Second Amendment proponents are criticizing the policies of an Israeli music festival that was attacked by Hamas militants over the weekend.

Thousands of people were dancing at the Supernova festival early Saturday when the surprise assault on Israel took place. After hearing sirens and rockets go off, festival-goers heard a barrage of gunfire that halted the music and sent crowds scrambling to get to safety. At least 260 bodies have been recovered from the festival site in the Negev Desert in southern Israel, according to rescue agency Zaka.

Posting a link to a Washington Post report about how the attack occurred at the festival, which was one of the first targets of the Hamas assault, conservative commentator Katie Pavlich commented on the festival policies that prevented attendees from bringing guns onto festival grounds.

"The ravers were told not to bring firearms or sharp objects onto the festival grounds. They were tired and defenseless, trapped in a wide-open area that offered few hiding places," Pavlich wrote, quoting the Post story, in a post on X (formerly Twitter).

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/is ... r-AA1hVfMD

[RufusXG]

Maybe it's less "We respect your rights" than "You're on your own!".

[Joe_Blacke]

With all the actual Israelites I’ve encountered, they don’t want to carry guns. Israel is a very secular hippie type of place. They are very strong believers that the government is responsible for protecting them.

Even after all that has happened to them in their history they don’t want to protect themselves. They want it to be someone else’s job. A lot of that does come from the government who does sort of beat that into them. A lot of “it’s our job to protect you, we have the manpower and equipment, you just go live your life”.

[samnev]

Guess had have to learn the hard way.

[hrob]

I wouldn't say they've exactly "reversed" their stance.

From the Ministry of National Security Firearm Licensing Department:

1. Every civilian eligible for a firearm license, as per the licensing criteria for self defense or service in a security agency, with no criminal record or health issue, can undergo a telephone interview instead of an in-person one, and be issued a firearm license within a week. Licensing criteria includes: residence in an eligible city, completion of 07 military training, officers with the rank of Lieutenant or higher and non-commissioned officers with the rank of Master Sergeant or higher in the military or security agencies, service in special units, firefighters, police officers and employees and volunteers in rescue agencies.

2. Any civilian who was granted approval for a firearm license in 2023 but did not purchase a firearm and the approval has expired, can now purchase a firearm without renewing the approval. This applies to some 4,000 civilians.

3. Any civilian who turned in their firearm in the past six months because they did not complete the renewal training, can reclaim their firearm. This exemption applies to some 1,800 civilians.

4. Additionally, beginning on Tuesday, new firearm licenses will be granted with permission to purchase 100 bullets, instead of the current 50.

Considering their circumstances, Israelis still have astonishingly strict gun control.

[RufusXG]

"bullets"? Got some real gun people handling the licenses there.

[hrob]

From the Times of Israel:

https://www.timesofisrael.com/comparing ... revealing/

"Once they are granted the right to carry a gun, Israelis are limited to just 50 (now 100) bullets in their possession at any given time. They must shoot or return old bullets before they can buy new ones, a process that can only take place at tightly regulated shooting ranges where each bullet’s sale is carefully registered. The types of guns permitted also depend on the reason for the license – i.e., a veterinarian may only purchase a gun approved by the government for the killing of animals, a hunter’s license only permits the purchase of a firearm from an approved firearms list kept by the Parks Authority, and so forth."

I will admit I was shocked to learn that Israel has such draconian gun laws. I always thought, since the streets of Israel were awash in arms, that citizens were also free to bear arms. Apparently not.

[paulgt2164]

They didn't reverse their stance on gun control, just like the Ukraine didn't.

They are basically hoping their unarmed citizens will now be an army of convenience. If they are victorious they will go back to the draconian laws they had - and from what I have gathered from some friends that live over there - they are perfectly fine with that.

Personally, and this will probably be an unpopular opinion - I couldn't care less about what is going on over there just as I couldn't care less about the Ukraine. Let them sort it out. Dumping our tax dollars and our people into these conflicts is nothing more than a bunch of old, outdated way past expiration date politicians wet dream to finally have the war against Russia they missed out on in the Cold war - albeit vicariously and this Israel conflict will justify an extension on the war on terror and further justification for crap like the Patriot Act. IMO we need to pull our forces back, strengthen our borders, and be covertly proactive in ensuring Hamas, Iran, and Hezbollah don't decide to expand their efforts in our directions. We have the most advanced intelligence systems, drones, and networks in the world. We should sit back, watch, and see which silly dumb religion wins out while protecting our own. F*ck the whole lot of them, and meddling in their wars will jeopardize our security. But I am sure the politicians will gladly "sacrifice" to line their pockets.

[hrob]

They didn't reverse their stance on gun control, just like the Ukraine didn't.

They are basically hoping their unarmed citizens will now be an army of convenience. If they are victorious they will go back to the draconian laws they had - and from what I have gathered from some friends that live over there - they are perfectly fine with that.

Personally, and this will probably be an unpopular opinion - I couldn't care less about what is going on over there just as I couldn't care less about the Ukraine. Let them sort it out. Dumping our tax dollars and our people into these conflicts is nothing more than a bunch of old, outdated way past expiration date politicians wet dream to finally have the war against Russia they missed out on in the Cold war - albeit vicariously and this Israel conflict will justify an extension on the war on terror and further justification for crap like the Patriot Act. IMO we need to pull our forces back, strengthen our borders, and be covertly proactive in ensuring Hamas, Iran, and Hezbollah don't decide to expand their efforts in our directions. We have the most advanced intelligence systems, drones, and networks in the world. We should sit back, watch, and see which silly dumb religion wins out while protecting our own. F*ck the whole lot of them, and meddling in their wars will jeopardize our security. But I am sure the politicians will gladly "sacrifice" to line their pockets.

Doesn't seem like an unpopular opinion at all. That's just good common sense.

[smithers599]

Instead of only 50 rounds, now you can have 100.
These are unserious people.

[Joe_Blacke]

You have to understand that Israelites, and even a lot of western secular Jews, have a strong socialist viewpoint. They believe that the government should handle things like protecting people. It’s a collective tasks not an individual role.

Take a look at something that is unique and is truly Jewish lifestyle. The Kibbutz. It is a socialist collective where there is no individual ownership. Regardless of your job, everyone gets paid the same. Everyone works together for the collective good. Even though their popularity has waned, they are still a big part of Jewish life.

To us, living like that is nuts. However to Jews, many shun capitalism or individualism.

[MarkItZero]

From the Times of Israel:

https://www.timesofisrael.com/comparing ... revealing/

"Once they are granted the right to carry a gun, Israelis are limited to just 50 (now 100) bullets in their possession at any given time. They must shoot or return old bullets before they can buy new ones, a process that can only take place at tightly regulated shooting ranges where each bullet’s sale is carefully registered. The types of guns permitted also depend on the reason for the license – i.e., a veterinarian may only purchase a gun approved by the government for the killing of animals, a hunter’s license only permits the purchase of a firearm from an approved firearms list kept by the Parks Authority, and so forth."

I will admit I was shocked to learn that Israel has such draconian gun laws. I always thought, since the streets of Israel were awash in arms, that citizens were also free to bear arms. Apparently not.

Most of those Israelis you see pictures of carrying guns are military reservists and the gun technically still belongs to the IDF.

Otherwise guns are mostly issued to civilians living in especially dangerous places like the Golan Heights or West Bank Settlements. Getting a permit when you live in Tel Aviv or Haifa is very difficult.

[kenpoprofessor]

Israelis want to live a "gun free" life, and honestly, I'm not sympathetic that they didn't have them when they needed them. For gawd's sake, the holocaust didn't teach 'em a damn thing so let them live and die as they choose. They got "KrapMaga", which BTW, is American Kenpo done very badly, so they can use the only weapons they have.


Have a great, gun carryin', Kenpo day

Clyde

[smithers599]

Israelis want to live a "gun free" life, and honestly, I'm not sympathetic that they didn't have them when they needed them. For gawd's sake, the holocaust didn't teach 'em a damn thing so let them live and die as they choose. They got "KrapMaga", which BTW, is American Kenpo done very badly, so they can use the only weapons they have.


Have a great, gun carryin', Kenpo day

Clyde

John Farnam came up with the acronym, "VBC," which means "Victim By Choice." If you live next door to sadistic fanatics who openly say that they want to kill you, and you don't have a gun, then you might be a VBC.
Israelis have not only lost their gun rights, apparently they have lost their fighting spirit. If 1000 old, sick unarmed German Jews had all attacked 50 armed Nazis, then they would have killed the 50 Nazis, 200 of the Jews would have died, and 800 would have survived. But they all submissively got on the train, so all 1000 of them died.
The Jews in Germany had an excuse. They didn't know they were going to be killed.
Jews in Israel in 2023 do not have that excuse. They should have figured out by now that if you don't fight back, you will get killed. If the teenagers at the music festival had all swarmed the Hamas terrorists with their bare hands, many of them would have died, but many more of them would have survived, and they would have killed all the terrorists.

The only acceptable response to the threat of lethal violence is immediate and savage counterattack. If you resist, you just may get killed. If you don't resist you almost certainly will get killed. It is a tough choice, but there is only one right answer.
Jeff Cooper

Fight back! Whenever you are offered violence, fight back! The aggressor does not fear the law, so he must be taught to fear you. Whatever the risk, and at whatever the cost, fight back!

[YotaSauce]

What an interesting response to your country's people being slaughtered in the streets. This is like getting security cameras on your house after a break in has happened. I'm still very saddened by what happened.