FROM THE SIG FORUM

[Tenring]

I think HK and Sig are both done in Germany now.
Sig for sure has been plummeting in quality and standing behind their customers with supported products, haven't noticed the same yet with HK.

Glad my Sigs are classics.

[xerts1191]

https://www.nhpr.org/nh-news/2024-02-29 ... igger-pull#
7 more p320 owners making a claim

[338lapua]

How many would shoot themselves in the leg for a million? Highly trained police officer? I see them all the time at the range and half can't hit the target due to lack of practice.

[kenpoprofessor]

How many would shoot themselves in the leg for a million? Highly trained police officer? I see them all the time at the range and half can't hit the target due to lack of practice.

Carlos can tell you much about how the BP shoot But, he is literally a world class shooter, I'm glad I just teach him martial skills, and he teaches me the gun fu he knows.

Have a great, gun carryin', Kenpo day

Clyde

[Noshoot]

How many would shoot themselves in the leg for a million? Highly trained police officer? I see them all the time at the range and half can't hit the target due to lack of practice.

The frightening stories I could tell you all from my time at YCSO (the county down in the SW corner).

It may surprise many that there are LEO’s out there that take 2,3,4 attempts to re-qualify….

[WhiteDragon]

I take the stories of Sigs AD'ing w cops with a grain of salt. I see a lot of poor gun handling from the LE community on the daily. I've said before that about 70% of LE aren't shooters and maybe 10% or less do additional training to maintain and/or improve their skillset. Human error is a very real possibility and almost all will blame the gun instead of owning their mistake. Could the gun fail? Absolutely. Is it likely? No.

[YNOTAZ]

I've said before that about 70% of LE aren't shooters and maybe 10% or less do additional training to maintain and/or improve their skillset.

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Before I left the job I did training of officers, not new recruits. That was a long time ago but I think your 70% and 10% are, bit exaggerated.

[WhiteDragon]

I've said before that about 70% of LE aren't shooters and maybe 10% or less do additional training to maintain and/or improve their skillset.

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Before I left the job I did training of officers, not new recruits. That was a long time ago but I think your 70% and 10% are, bit exaggerated.

I've been in LE for 30 years, 28 as an instructor. My numbers are conservative at best and based on my own experience. Guarantee you if you made quals a choice for officers/agents, you'd never see 70% of them ever again. If your experience is different, whoopty-freakin-doo. I train people for a living and THIS is what I see on a daily.

[338lapua]

How many would shoot themselves in the leg for a million? Highly trained police officer? I see them all the time at the range and half can't hit the target due to lack of practice.

Carlos can tell you much about how the BP shoot But, he is literally a world class shooter, I'm glad I just teach him martial skills, and he teaches me the gun fu he knows.

Have a great, gun carryin', Kenpo day

Clyde

I shot with a couple cops for the state and they are there often and they run drills They can hit targets. I dont think most cops adopt the gun culture like us shooters do.

[YNOTAZ]

I've been in LE for 30 years, 28 as an instructor. My numbers are conservative at best and based on my own experience. Guarantee you if you made quals a choice for officers/agents, you'd never see 70% of them ever again. If your experience is different, whoopty-freakin-doo. I train people for a living and THIS is what I see on a daily.

For clarity, I agree with you. You may have taken my comment as opposite, but my experience was much worse than yours.

In my experience the 70% who aren't shooters should be closer to 80-85% and 10% who are capable shooters should be reduced to 5% or less. The only LEOs that could shoot worth a damn, in my experience, were on our competition pistol team. Not that we were great, we only took one county match and never a statewide match, but the other 4 guys were the only ones that practiced. The guys from other agencies had the same comments about their departments. Very few of those departments funded their shooting teams as part of their training programs.

[WhiteDragon]

I've been in LE for 30 years, 28 as an instructor. My numbers are conservative at best and based on my own experience. Guarantee you if you made quals a choice for officers/agents, you'd never see 70% of them ever again. If your experience is different, whoopty-freakin-doo. I train people for a living and THIS is what I see on a daily.

For clarity, I agree with you. You may have taken my comment as opposite, but my experience was much worse than yours.

In my experience the 70% who aren't shooters should be closer to 80-85% and 10% who are capable shooters should be reduced to 5% or less. The only LEOs that could shoot worth a damn, in my experience, were on our competition pistol team. Not that we were great, we only took one county match and never a statewide match, but the other 4 guys were the only ones that practiced. The guys from other agencies had the same comments about their departments. Very few of those departments funded their shooting teams as part of their training programs.

Ah, gotcha. Yes, I agree and its sad... really sad. I equate it to would you go under the knife w a surgeon who doesn't practice his cuts and/or sutures? Why are we not extremely proficient w the life-saving tools of our profession??? Why are we so over-reliant on toys and gadgets (tazers, oc, etc) that tend to fail and we not practice H2H proficiency and basic fitness? Do we give a s*** about our what we do??? I'm old, my body is failing me but brother, I'm out there training and training as many as would want, but like you stated, it's a small percentage.

Anyway, we've strayed far enough... back to bashing Sigs.

[kenpoprofessor]

Ah, gotcha. Yes, I agree and its sad... really sad. I equate it to would you go under the knife w a surgeon who doesn't practice his cuts and/or sutures? Why are we not extremely proficient w the life-saving tools of our profession??? Why are we so over-reliant on toys and gadgets (tazers, oc, etc) that tend to fail and we not practice H2H proficiency and basic fitness? Do we give a s*** about our what we do??? I'm old, my body is failing me but brother, I'm out there training and training as many as would want, but like you stated, it's a small percentage.

Anyway, we've strayed far enough... back to bashing Sigs.

You hear the saying: They put their lives on the line for us every day. Man, what a load of bullshiiitee. If they truly did, they'd be more proficient with their weapons and use of force. How many innocent citizens are shot by police each year? Hmm, I just checked, they give limited results.

https://www.google.com/search?q=innocen ... -serp#ip=1


https://www.denverpost.com/2022/08/17/d ... a-victims/

Hell, NY folks are always being shot. Oh, that's right, they have "qualified immunity" for their acts, oooopps a goof.

Have a great, gun carryin', Kenpo day

Clyde