The reality of finding food, "In the Woods"

[Steve_In_29]

Absent a prepared and welcoming destination a person "bugging out" is really just a REFUGEE.


Speaking of "guns pointed at you" that is how I first met my neighbor when we were looking to buy the property. The night before we were meeting the realtor for a tour, we had gone out there (so I could show my wife exactly how dark/quiet it gets 10 miles outside a tiny town) and after looking around for a while as we were leaving I got a flashlight in the face so I stopped and SLOWLY got out of my truck with hands in plain sight.

After some pointed questions on his part and apparently satisfactory answers on my part, the light came out of my face. As it did so I saw the AR go from pointing AT me to settling into the crook of his arm. He is my kind of guy and we are now new best friends. Both very happy that the other wasn't some douche-bag hipster that moved out for the country "experience".

[shooter444]

I am curious though , just what is everyone worried about that they think they need some place to bug out too ?

VERY good question. Most folks I know have various "what if" scenarios, all with some validity. But, a threat that puts it into perspective for me, is the real possibility of a renegade country like North Korea/Iran/etc., setting of a high altitude nuclear explosion creating an electromagnetic pulse and basically ending daily life amenities as we have come to enjoy. That scenario will not result in thousands driving anywhere, nor staying in place with the normal infrastructure we enjoy.

Our Government is just on the edge of dealing with protecting our national electric grid, but has a very long way to go.

As to "living off the land"! I have been fortunate in my life to have lived in the forests, mountains, ocean shore, and desert areas and learned what these areas have to offer. I have put myself in extended hunting situations that required eating what I could find, and believe me, filling my belly got priority over counting calories!

Bottom line, there are still some natural habitat's one can survive in, but, too many you can't. Picking a viable location to survive in, is the key. But without any electric apparatus to get you there, it suddenly becomes more real than most will be able to deal with. Suddenly the viability of beasts of burden come into play, something most folks don't think about. jmo.

[AZGEEZER]

Those "what if" hypothitical secnarios are virtually endless, but valid as far of likely possibilities. Those nasty EPM's will wreak havoc on a grand scale. Anyone here remember Obozo taking all this $ in order to fix the power grid? That went well didn't it?

Something like that happens don't expect cars to work right if at all. There's a reason why the military is excluded from EPA standards, think about it.

Getting gas for your vehicle is going to be fun, but I can carry on about this. Who knows.....there might be a run on syphon hoses.

[What]

Another thing to consider is wildfire. Without a doubt, there will be wildfires happening. That's going to have a huge impact.

[Viper 1-26 INF]

I feel the EMP threat is mostly hype. Why would nation-states, FTOs, or rogue regimes pour millions of dollars, resources, and manpower into a type of weapon that has never been tested or scientifically proven to work, as many believe it would, when they could spend thousands of dollars instead on hackers and attack the internet-connected industrial control systems (4th Generation SCADA systems) of critical infrastructure in the United States, potentially doing far more damage than they would be able to with an EMP, anonymously? If they launch an untested EMP device, which would basically just be a nuclear warhead, we would know who launched it and would be dropping nukes on them ensuring their destruction. It just isn't feasible, or smart, for any foreign actors to go the route of using an EMP when there are cheaper, more effective measures out there that give them anonymity or plausible deniability. If foreign actors want to use EMPs they might as well just drop nukes on cities because they'll have more effect in the short time that their country as they know it will still exist. Threats in cyberspace are our number one challenge to national security. We've seen Russia testing out these types of cyber attacks on critical infrastructure in Ukraine in December 2015 and June 2017. In the December 2015 attack on the Ukrainian power grid, they also hit call centers with telephony denial-of-service attacks, so that the outages couldn't be reported. Unlike EMPs, the potential dangers from cyber threats increase as the Internet-of-Things (IoT) grows, which it is doing at a rapid pace. It is already known that Iranian and Russian linked hackers have infiltrated US power grid and dam computer systems...

I'll admit that while the method of attack/knocking out the power grid might be different, the preparation and survival in these situations would be almost identical.


Just my $0.02

[Steve_In_29]

Another thing to consider is wildfire. Without a doubt, there will be wildfires happening. That's going to have a huge impact.

This is why we didn't buy a place in the woods when we moved to AZ. Living in a forest is nice...right up until the fire goes through and after you rebuild, you aren't living in the forest anymore for 50+ years.

[AZGEEZER]

For me fires aren't a concern, except for the trees in the background it's pretty much the same in all directions. It seems about our only concern is food, and growing it isn't as easy as putting seeds in the ground and adding water. And that's just the shop, not the house.

We've been through a couple of big fires here, the smoke is really bad. So bad solar panels don't like to work very well. We managed fine, the swamp cooler kinda filtered out most of the smoke, but the generator was used more.

[Quake_Guy]

after watching Top Gear nuke a modern day Volkswagen with a bazillion volts, I don't find EMP fears credible. I mean a VW electrical system barely functions when new, to survive what it did in the video, I think EMP is mostly BS.

sparks start flying at 3:45:

[Gatsby]

...It is already known that Iranian and Russian linked hackers have infiltrated US power grid and dam computer systems...

That whole response was well reasoned, and I agree that the biggest foreign threat is technological. Accidents and sabotage would likely be very local and not capable of taking down large areas of the Country all at once.

Also, don't discount China in the state sponsored hacking list. They're also active in that arena.

[Viper 1-26 INF]

...It is already known that Iranian and Russian linked hackers have infiltrated US power grid and dam computer systems...

That whole response was well reasoned, and I agree that the biggest foreign threat is technological. Accidents and sabotage would likely be very local and not capable of taking down large areas of the Country all at once.

Also, don't discount China in the state sponsored hacking list. They're also active in that arena.

I don't discount them, but right now they primarily conduct espionage rather than disruption. They would rather steal intellectual property and collect government and personal data at this point, but they're capabilities, as well as those of North Korea, in this arena are not lacking much behind Russia and are always evolving.

[Crippledtrigger]

Im not so sure emp's will have the desired effect. I have seen tests go both ways. 1 where the vehicle and personal electronic stuff dies and stays dead and another where they shut off and are then turned back on. Both had the device generating the emp right next to it. I think alot depends on how the wave propagates and what is between it and the item. A full faraday cage isn't necessary in all instances. The grid however? Remember 20 years ago+/- when the big transformer burned up in the West valley? The only replacement in the WORLD was out of the country and we had rolling blackouts most the summer till it got here. That will be a real s*** storm if it happens in volume.

Not everything is set in stone, especially stuff the gooberment tells you. He'll people at ground zero under the a bombs in Japan survived. With varying degrees of injury from blown eardrums to horrific burns. Some got cancer some didnt. Most died but not everything is preordained or predestined. Then again that's why you prep right?

[knockonit]

Hehe, i think it s a hoot to see comments, from folks in the hills, as they will have visitors who are under the impression that they would be welcome, all the more reason to have a plan, and have an alternate plan.

it would be weeks before anyone could get outta phoenix, the first few hours would destroy any exit opportunity, stupid selfish folks will create blockages of monumental proportions that will destroy most opportunity to run.

best to hunker down, keep quiet, and recon till one knows of how, when , where and who.

just saying
Rj

[Flash]

Hehe, i think it s a hoot to see comments, from folks in the hills, as they will have visitors who are under the impression that they would be welcome, all the more reason to have a plan, and have an alternate plan.

it would be weeks before anyone could get outta phoenix, the first few hours would destroy any exit opportunity, stupid selfish folks will create blockages of monumental proportions that will destroy most opportunity to run.

best to hunker down, keep quiet, and recon till one knows of how, when , where and who.

just saying
Rj

Sound advice, RJ. People get some strange ideas about bugging out and their chances of accomplishing it.

Long pig

Nicely played. I wonder if I'm the only one who caught this.

[AZGEEZER]

Hehe, i think it s a hoot to see comments, from folks in the hills, as they will have visitors who are under the impression that they would be welcome, all the more reason to have a plan, and have an alternate plan.

it would be weeks before anyone could get outta phoenix, the first few hours would destroy any exit opportunity, stupid selfish folks will create blockages of monumental proportions that will destroy most opportunity to run.

best to hunker down, keep quiet, and recon till one knows of how, when , where and who.

just saying
Rj

When I say/write things, I have a habit of summarizing things and leaving out the details. I hear that word "HELP" a lot, and the newer generation goes overboard with it. Us old pharts were brought up knowing that help meant everyone works together to achieve a given task. In today's climate it leans towards having someone with what they want do it for them. Dunno about the rest of you folks, but correct me if I'm wrong, and I don't think I'm in the wrong. It's more like you doing something for someone else, and that isn't help in my book.

Even up here living outside the box as it were, there will be issues. Things like fuel for cars and especially a generator, as well as food since transportation will be at a stand-still. Most folks have no idea what "YOUR ONLY AS STRONG AS YOUR WEAKEST LINK" refers to.

[AZGEEZER]

Long pig

OK I saw Ole Flashes post.

Now for the rest of us dimwits....what does that mean?