Beware of Frontier (hornady) ammo
- FenixMike
- ArizonaShooting.org Member
- Posts: 67
- Joined: May 22nd, 2018, 4:51 pm
- Reputation: 0
- Location: Albuquerque, NM
Beware of Frontier (hornady) ammo
I will start by saying this... ive been a HUGE Hornady supporter since day 1. I use their duty ammo on duty, their bullets for reloading, and their factory ammo for most calibers I run. I had decent luck with the Frontier ammo in the past, so I ordered 500 rounds of the 75 Gr OTM Match 223 for my Knights LPR. I had 5 other kinds of ammo out with me that day as well, so I only brought a box of each to see what the rifle liked best... When I opened the Hornady box, I was a bit annoyed to find two FMJ rounds stuck in the box with 18 OTM rounds. I contacted Hornady, they basically said ammo is fine, go shoot it. Obviously I figured it was safe to shoot, however I was more concerned with spending $14 a box and receiving $6 a box ammo mixed in. After emailing my concerns, they agreed to send me a box of comparable ammo, which was fine.
Fast forward to today, retesting with some new ammo I received recently, so I grabbed 2 more boxes of Frontier from my 500 round case. Sure enough, both boxes had FMJ mixed in. One box had 3 rounds, The other had 2 rounds. Now im a bit angry that quality control is complete crap. All from the same lot number, same brass, same looking crimp, etc. So after shooting today, I got home and opened up all the boxes. Of the 25 boxes, only THREE had all OTM rounds. The rest had between 1-6 FMJ rounds mixed in. If my 500 rounds had that many in there, im sure the whole lot (and who knows if others) are affected as well. I emailed Hornady today, so we will see if they want it all back and replace it, or just replace the total number of FMJ rounds. Total I found was 65 FMJ rounds, and one random soft point. Thats over 13% mismatched.
I figured id at least notify people looking to save a few bucks on match ammo... you get what you pay for. Thankfully the 73 and 75 gr match ammo actually labeled Hornady were all the correct rounds.
Fast forward to today, retesting with some new ammo I received recently, so I grabbed 2 more boxes of Frontier from my 500 round case. Sure enough, both boxes had FMJ mixed in. One box had 3 rounds, The other had 2 rounds. Now im a bit angry that quality control is complete crap. All from the same lot number, same brass, same looking crimp, etc. So after shooting today, I got home and opened up all the boxes. Of the 25 boxes, only THREE had all OTM rounds. The rest had between 1-6 FMJ rounds mixed in. If my 500 rounds had that many in there, im sure the whole lot (and who knows if others) are affected as well. I emailed Hornady today, so we will see if they want it all back and replace it, or just replace the total number of FMJ rounds. Total I found was 65 FMJ rounds, and one random soft point. Thats over 13% mismatched.
I figured id at least notify people looking to save a few bucks on match ammo... you get what you pay for. Thankfully the 73 and 75 gr match ammo actually labeled Hornady were all the correct rounds.
- shooter444
- ArizonaShooting.org Member
- Posts: 1790
- Joined: May 14th, 2018, 1:17 pm
- Reputation: 6
- Location: Az desert
Re: Beware of Frontier (hornady) ammo
I am glad you posted pics, if, the three of the four first pictured, is what you are referring to as FMJ,... I know exactly what you are talking about.
First let me say that I have found the same looking material/ hollow point bullets in some Barnes 36 gr, all copper bullets, I load.
I was very leery of the deformation as well, and kept them separated after loading them, to see if there would be any deviation in accuracy.
There wasn't!
I then remembered reading a VERY LONG TIME AGO, about how what I call HOLLOW POINT BULLETS (and maybe you) really aren't HP ammo,... the hole in the nose of these bullets are an end product result from manufacturing.
Why manufacturers call these HOLLOW POINTS,... I believe,... is a marketing thing!!!
And, I have never recovered one, in the bank of my home range, that opened up to resemble any other hollow point I have used. In fact, these so-called Hollow Point Bullets burn through tempered steel T posts as if they were butter, something I wouldn't expect from a Hollow Point!
I could be wrong,... been there before ,... but I think a down to earth and real conversation with a Hornady Tech Service guy, or any other manufacturer's tech guy, may shed more light on this situation.
_________________________________________________________________________
Oscar Wilde,...
“Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery that mediocrity can pay to greatness.” __________________________________________________________________________
First let me say that I have found the same looking material/ hollow point bullets in some Barnes 36 gr, all copper bullets, I load.
I was very leery of the deformation as well, and kept them separated after loading them, to see if there would be any deviation in accuracy.
There wasn't!
I then remembered reading a VERY LONG TIME AGO, about how what I call HOLLOW POINT BULLETS (and maybe you) really aren't HP ammo,... the hole in the nose of these bullets are an end product result from manufacturing.
Why manufacturers call these HOLLOW POINTS,... I believe,... is a marketing thing!!!
And, I have never recovered one, in the bank of my home range, that opened up to resemble any other hollow point I have used. In fact, these so-called Hollow Point Bullets burn through tempered steel T posts as if they were butter, something I wouldn't expect from a Hollow Point!
I could be wrong,... been there before ,... but I think a down to earth and real conversation with a Hornady Tech Service guy, or any other manufacturer's tech guy, may shed more light on this situation.
_________________________________________________________________________
Oscar Wilde,...
“Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery that mediocrity can pay to greatness.” __________________________________________________________________________
- Jack Dupp
- ArizonaShooting.org Member
- Posts: 901
- Joined: May 14th, 2018, 3:15 pm
- Reputation: 5
- Location: Mesa
Re: Beware of Frontier (hornady) ammo
I'm not so sure those are FMJs mixed in. I think they are just OTMs like the rest that tip got smashed or closed up in manufacturing/assembly.
- FenixMike
- ArizonaShooting.org Member
- Posts: 67
- Joined: May 22nd, 2018, 4:51 pm
- Reputation: 0
- Location: Albuquerque, NM
Re: Beware of Frontier (hornady) ammo
If you look closely, they are a completely different bullet. The Ogive is completely different on the hollow point.
- shooter444
- ArizonaShooting.org Member
- Posts: 1790
- Joined: May 14th, 2018, 1:17 pm
- Reputation: 6
- Location: Az desert
Re: Beware of Frontier (hornady) ammo
It is a manufacturing defect,... that's all,... they'll shoot fine.
You could pull a couple, just to make sure they are the same weight as the bullets with a clean hole, otherwise, not to worry.
_________________________________________________________________________
Oscar Wilde,...
“Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery that mediocrity can pay to greatness.” __________________________________________________________________________
You could pull a couple, just to make sure they are the same weight as the bullets with a clean hole, otherwise, not to worry.
_________________________________________________________________________
Oscar Wilde,...
“Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery that mediocrity can pay to greatness.” __________________________________________________________________________
Last edited by shooter444 on May 10th, 2020, 8:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
- FenixMike
- ArizonaShooting.org Member
- Posts: 67
- Joined: May 22nd, 2018, 4:51 pm
- Reputation: 0
- Location: Albuquerque, NM
Re: Beware of Frontier (hornady) ammo
Well, Hornady admitted the wrong bullets were loaded when I sent them the photos, and my mic says they are different, and my eyes say they are different. Maybe were all crazy and youre correct.shooter444 wrote: ↑May 10th, 2020, 8:26 pm It is a manufacturing defect,... that's all,... they shoot fine.
You could pull a couple, just to make sure they are the same weight as the bullets with a clean hole, otherwise, not to worry.
_________________________________________________________________________
Oscar Wilde,...
“Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery that mediocrity can pay to greatness.” __________________________________________________________________________
- FenixMike
- ArizonaShooting.org Member
- Posts: 67
- Joined: May 22nd, 2018, 4:51 pm
- Reputation: 0
- Location: Albuquerque, NM
Re: Beware of Frontier (hornady) ammo
Just verified. Youre wrong... unless my eyes are deceiving me and these are actually two identical bullets I just pulled out. Maybe the defect was they forgot 30 grains of lead in each projectile.
- shooter444
- ArizonaShooting.org Member
- Posts: 1790
- Joined: May 14th, 2018, 1:17 pm
- Reputation: 6
- Location: Az desert
Re: Beware of Frontier (hornady) ammo
Very Good! Looks like to took some really great advice!
Have a nice night.
_________________________________________________________________________
Oscar Wilde,...
“Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery that mediocrity can pay to greatness.” _________________________________________________________________________
Have a nice night.
_________________________________________________________________________
Oscar Wilde,...
“Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery that mediocrity can pay to greatness.” _________________________________________________________________________
- Ben7
- ArizonaShooting.org Member
- Posts: 163
- Joined: July 30th, 2019, 4:45 pm
- Reputation: 4
- Location: Phoenix
Re: Beware of Frontier (hornady) ammo
Equal amount of powder in each case?
- Jack Dupp
- ArizonaShooting.org Member
- Posts: 901
- Joined: May 14th, 2018, 3:15 pm
- Reputation: 5
- Location: Mesa
Re: Beware of Frontier (hornady) ammo
Wow, I stand corrected. That really is a big screw up!
- Jack Dupp
- ArizonaShooting.org Member
- Posts: 901
- Joined: May 14th, 2018, 3:15 pm
- Reputation: 5
- Location: Mesa
Re: Beware of Frontier (hornady) ammo
Wow, I stand corrected. That really is a big screw up!
- FenixMike
- ArizonaShooting.org Member
- Posts: 67
- Joined: May 22nd, 2018, 4:51 pm
- Reputation: 0
- Location: Albuquerque, NM
Re: Beware of Frontier (hornady) ammo
While I dont have a scale, visually the 55 gr case appeared to have more powder. Tough to say if Hornady just stuck loaded 55 gr ammo in with the 75 gr stuff somehow, or something else occurred. I haven't shot any of the 55 grain stuff.
- deanq
- ArizonaShooting.org Member
- Posts: 121
- Joined: May 15th, 2018, 7:27 am
- Reputation: 2
- Location: Buckeye
Re: Beware of Frontier (hornady) ammo
Did you contact Hornady? What did they say?
- Ben7
- ArizonaShooting.org Member
- Posts: 163
- Joined: July 30th, 2019, 4:45 pm
- Reputation: 4
- Location: Phoenix
Re: Beware of Frontier (hornady) ammo
That would lead me to believe that the it was mispackaged rather than misloaded. Still sucks, but it is most likely safe to shoot.
- FenixMike
- ArizonaShooting.org Member
- Posts: 67
- Joined: May 22nd, 2018, 4:51 pm
- Reputation: 0
- Location: Albuquerque, NM
Re: Beware of Frontier (hornady) ammo
When I opened the first box, they were like cool, its fine, go shoot it. I complained and said I wasn't concerned with the safety, but the fact that I got ripped off and paid for match ammo. They said well, that sucks, we dont stock that stuff and its backordered. Finally after going back and forth, they offered to send a comparable box of the Hornady branded 75 gr. That was before I opened more boxes and sent them more photos, so not sure what they will do. Usually takes a week or so to respond.